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Phrygian Dominant · Joined: 14 Oct 2006 Posts: 583 Location: Seattle

On measure 6 of a dominant blues I often like to substitute the V7 for the IV7 chord resolving back to the I7, to create the feeling of more motion when going from IV7 to I7. Idea

I also like to use the dominant bebop scale at times on a blues.
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ed norton · Joined: 03 Nov 2005 Posts: 763

If you listen to and play alot of blues you will realize that the one chord is more often minor than Dominant. The "one dom" is taught in books, but on the radio more often the one is minor. Obviously the one chord is minor in minor blues,duh, but i'm talking about regular 12 bar blues. I know I'm right, I play alot of blues tunes, and I mean people like Shemika Copeland and Joe Louis Walker, The "one dom" with all the 9 chords that people play at blues jams sounds cliche and corny to me. Listen to the bass lines in real blues by modern groups and most certainly the horn lines. Blues to me is a minor tonality more often than not. Don't make me bring in known experts to slam your sense of rich boy entitlement. Don't tell me "end chat".

Phrygian Dominant · Joined: 14 Oct 2006 Posts: 583 Location: Seattle

greentone · Joined: 31 May 2008 Posts: 667

jazzkat · Posted: Mon Aug 18, 2008 5:23 pm Post subject:

dewey decibel · Joined: 15 Feb 2006 Posts: 1677

Cmaj doesn't have anything to do with a G7 in a blues, ay least not anymore than any other chord harmonized from a G7 scale. In a blues the 7th chord is the I chord- that's what makes it a blues.

As far as the I7 chord being minor I have to agree with Greentone. Yes, you'll often hear a b3rd being played over that chord, but it doesn't mean it's a minor chord. That brings us back to the original "blue note", which isn't the b5 as is commonly taught today. It's a note inbetween the b3rd and maj3rd, and it was developed by singers. The b3rd over the maj3rd is what gives the blues it's sound.

jazzkat · Posted: Tue Aug 19, 2008 12:27 pm Post subject:

JakeJew · Joined: 30 Jul 2005 Posts: 2192 Location: Boston, MA

Never done much with this one myself, but yall can give it a try. Blues in G, play the whole form in Gb or Ab. Twisted Evil

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jazzerchick · Joined: 31 Oct 2006 Posts: 954 Location: SanAntonio , Tx

I do also, like Ed, like the sound of a minor 9 or minor 11 against the
I and IV dom. chords. It gives it a sus and 13 sound with the root still
the dom.7 chord. Basically it's the ii to the V, if you will. I would call it by
the name of the dom chord, yet it does have a sus sound.

steve · Joined: 04 Jun 2005 Posts: 867 Location: oz

Through my own studies I arrived at the conclusion that the indicator for a blues is a IV7 chord in bar 5 (and very often if it's 12 bars long that is also a reasonable indicator).

I suppose I'm talking jazz here. Whatever that is? Laughing

Here's a blues:

F#7 B7 | E7 A7 | D7 G7 | C7 F7 | Bb7 | A7 |

Ab7 | G7 | C7 | Bb7 | F D | B Ab ||

Indicator: IV7 in bar 5, 12 bars long (I do realise that blues can be of different lengths, especially if JL Hooker is playing it Laughing

)

Key?

= F (F blues)

Just some more food for thought (or fuel for the fire) I thought I'd offer.
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dewey decibel · Joined: 15 Feb 2006 Posts: 1677

jazzkat · Posted: Sat Aug 23, 2008 8:18 am Post subject:

ed norton · Joined: 03 Nov 2005 Posts: 763

Ok sorry, i get crazy everyone knows that. Jazzcat your post was kinda all over the place and I was annoyed that you argued back. Yes of course Cmaj = Gmixolydian, but in a G blues......ok whatever
Jazzerchick, yes I like the minor tensions against dom chords, but I was speaking of an RnB type of blues where the 1 chord is minor and the 4 chord is dom, so it's kinda modal. Many many tunes do it. Check out Mem Shannon , a great New Orleans bluesman if you get a chance. "Phunkville" is the name of the album. Like even if you take a standard root fifth blues pattern in E, the one everyone learns in 8th grade, well there is no third, just like many of the bass lines to classic blues tunes have no third. ........ Thanks for putting up with me.

jazzkat · Posted: Sun Aug 24, 2008 8:52 am Post subject:

Hey Ed, No probs. A bit of "lively" discussion never does any harm! Smile

I think the whole thing about a blues is that ambiguity over tonality.

The kind of "is it maj, min?" type thing, not to mention the lack of function of some of the harmony. Thats what makes it fun to play over I guess, so many options and note choices.

ed norton · Joined: 03 Nov 2005 Posts: 763

I used to jam with the radio on saturday's, I honestly did it for years. I grew up around some hot blues people in so. Cal and I guess my attempt was to get better at doing things on the fly. Grabbing keys and just jammin without hesitation or words. I do allright,but I guess i'm still working at it, and went back to it last night. I felt like the dj Jonny Meister was just sitting back with a smile demonstrating that minor thing about the blues that I fail at explaining to anyone. It's alot less jump blues and swing these days and alot more droning spookiness, and it still swings too, lots of minors though.