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[Hitdoggie]

Has anyone ever thought about this?

Teaching has been really great, and I have never had much problem with demand. However, increasing amounts of parents and adults are bothered as to why I can't do ensembles or big group lessons.

I have had a couple people speak with me about investing in a music school. I have lots of great ideas in this realm. However, it is my hunch that owning a music school isn't all that lucrative in the end?

[Gorecki]

I would say a lot of it is not different from expanding on a *one man* business in general. Once you've integrated other people (employee's) and facilities, your over all costs increase. Expenses for facilities is often expensive as well as insurances, materials, utilities...etc. The people will often require a wage also with insurances, you have to pay taxes (at least in the US). So it becomes far more complicated than it may be worth.

On the other hand, having a collective that function as independents and all *chip in* for facilities costs and related may be a better business plan. All have their own clients and all pay equal/appropriate amounts for facilities while basically still being an independent teacher but from within a named 'school'?
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[Hitdoggie]

Ya, I am going to look into it more. I just don't think in the end the profit ceiling for the business is high enough for sustained growth. I did a 65/35 split in wages figuring most teachers held 40 students, and without ensembles that doesn't leave much money left over for basic bills with room to reinvest in your business. It would be nice to build a business to the point where you are providing more for your employees in the way of benefits. I have been around small businesses growing up and understand the reality of sustained costs to keep the simplest thing going.

I am not a big fan of the "free agent" style of teaching, where teachers essentially pay room rental. I'd want a music school that contained teachers who seriously cared about working within a pedagogy that is different from the standard way things are done. Teaching methods that mesh with education and development research verses pure individual guess work. Any situation I encountered growing up and taking lessons, where teachers were paying room rental, provided for an environment that was very disconnected for learning.

Up this way many teachers are in it as a means of money to supplement their gigging life. This is totally cool if you care about what you do, but in a small pond up this way that is far from reality.

The school that used to be open closed a year ago because the owner was just to old to keep it going. There is a definite void for it.

[JakeJew]

Well you're making the assumption that you have to have a location. What about basically an agency that does in-house lessons? Tho driving is a pain, this is more up my alley because, well, you don't have to pay rent! Ensembles would then be out of the question, but you could still do recitals by renting out a location for an evening.

HD you might remember that I mentioned starting a school a while ago, and it's still on my mind. At times I've had another teacher under contract for me (basically ready to go teach some lessons under the name of my business) but for miscellaneous reasons it didn't work out, mainly because the guy had to move back to Texas.

I've had a lot of thoughts about the subject, but for now I gotta drink some coffee and practice. Personally my plan is just to take things one step at a time. I still have a few spots in my personal teaching schedule, but when that fills up I'll start looking more seriously at how to manage my overflow. My first step really is getting a decent website for myself.
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[MangoTango]

To test the water for this - if you want to get other teachers involved and want to try an ensemble basis, here's a thought.

I attend a workshop band most Saturday mornings - venue a local Church hall, tuition by qualified members with frequent "guest" sessions with name players, ensemble practice and playing. My playing has come on by leaps in the year and a half since I started with these guys, and I'm also in a quartet that incolves people from this collective.

So......get yourself an assistant to help you to co-ordinate. Hire a hall, arrange/hire a rhythm section, and run an Event for a day. Get your students (plus any other interested parties) to turn up and charge them an amount that works for you and them. Set out a syllabus, run a morning session for tuition, then one for playing, break for lunch, another tuition session, then organise them into "bands" and let them perform for each other. If you have enough of a response, you might bring in enough $$$'s not only to cover the costs of the day but maybe even bring in a "local hero" guest player.

The response you'd get would give more useful feedback to help you answer your question about a school; plus you'd have vibed up those students enough to keep them coming back for more.

Just an idea, but one that I've seen work for our collective.
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[Jazzy]

Hi there

Me and two friends of mine started a music school one and a half year ago. But I sold my share in february. It was a great experience, but LOTS of work. Especially the organizing bit! So I simply didn`t have the time for it.
We had about 50 students; guitar, bass, drums, vocal and piano.

Out of curiousity, how are the prices in the US? Thinking about rent, salary and stuff like that. How much do you charge when teaching?

I also recommend looking for an investor, `cause it`s quite expensive in the start. PR (flyers and stuff), website, rent...

[Hitdoggie]

Hi all:

Some great thoughts here - really appreciate it!


In regards to travel lessons- not effective in maine. You are doing a lot of driving to go from house to house, even when they are in the same town. Things here are spread out. I did this when I started teaching, and I still do 2 travel lessons now for write-off purposes," but it was a nightmare to try and get people in the same location. Not to mention, when I switched to a "studio" space I had no problem moving parents over. They were more than willing to stick with what they felt was quality instruction, than having the luxury of having someone come to their home. It also wasn't very professional. You are trying to teach Jimmy while Fido is trying to hump your leg. You are also in the child's or adult's space. This puts them at ease, but I felt a little too much.

I have thought of doing ensembles that way. There is a "non-profit" here that does traveling ensembles. They do it in the summer with "local musicians as teachers." Really cool business model, but the kids I knew who participated in it didn't feel they got much in the way of instruction out of it. I'm also not sure how they pull off being a "non-profit" charging the same rates a private music school would for students to enroll. Some of my students looking for other outlets do this. Coordinating gear has been a nightmare when I have looked at this in the past. There isn't a lot of "you scratch my back- I will scratch your's" between music teachers and music shops. To rent the gear I'd need for a week I could end up buying things used. First summer doing this I'd break even.


Jazzy- Here in maine the going rate an hour for teachers is 32-38$. Some people undercut that rate, by forcing everyone into hour lessons at 25$ a pop. Power to them, it limits the money you could make, and good luck keeping a 12 year old actively engaged that long. I'm sure there is high turn over.

Given the way the economy is now, and how real estate has been, I could get a building for 125-150K that would suffice. At that price you'd need about 50K in upgrades to fix things to spec for a business. So without an investor a bank would laugh at me! But I have had people talk about fronting the money for the building.

I figured for teachers 2 guitar, 1 bass, 1 piano,1 drums, 1 voice, 2 horns- appropriate hourly wages at a 65/35 split. I figure you get your room rental, gear use, copy use and don't have to chase money, and the school markets for you.

So the business takes 35%.

Six teachers

Hourly charge at 36$

Each teacher instructs 20 hours a week. It seems high, but is very feasible given the lack of schools in the area, and the location I am looking at. Hell, I have rented an office out of my parents house, and my marketing consisted of word of mouth and craigslist, and I always carry 20. I'm not even a "known" guy in the area as a player or teacher. It has been great.

So figure you teach 36 weeks a year, summers everyone is gone, and school vacations are useless.

Without ensembles you are talking about the business grossing around 52K. Sounds great? But after taxes to the FED, State and TOWN as a business, rent, utilities, etc.....that isn't a lot.

Even if ensembles raised that by 10K...you still aren't close to netting enough to invest back in your business and pay.

That is a crude sketch.

Now, there is one school in the area that caters to rich families. They charge 2 thousand a semester. I don't know how they pull it off. The teachers there are horrible. Maybe the illusion of exclusiveness does it?