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they've beaten me!
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Sideways Jaye



Joined: 19 Jan 2006
Posts: 7

PostPosted: Thu Jan 19, 2006 6:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Jake -

I won't argue with your perception. I can sort of see what you are saying here and there, but I also think Joe swings hard. I have an older quartet cd "Joy Spring," which is great and I particularly like "Tudo Bem," the cds with Ella Fitzgerald, and "Chops" with NHOP.

Having said that, I haven't picked up as much from Pass as Green simply because he is more of a dense series of notes player, comparatively speaking.

I find Green easier to deal with because there are so many bite-size phrases that sound good by themselves as well as in context.
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Coltrane



Joined: 17 Oct 2005
Posts: 26

PostPosted: Thu Jan 19, 2006 8:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

JakeJew wrote:
A critique of Joe Pass

Although I admire his vocabulary, I could never get to into Joe Pass. His feel always seems very rigid and mechanical to me...not a lot of subtlety in his playing, it's sometimes almost computer like. His swing 8th notes have a very blunt triplet feel to them, more so than most others I listen to.

Has anybody else observed this? I know he's regarded as one of the greats, and I can get into the greats...Wes, Tal, Jimmy Raney, Jim Hall, Charlie Christian...but Joe Pass man, I can't get too into him.


I agree completely. Like most, I was completely wowed by Joe's playing at first, and really amazed at what he could pull off. As my ears became more discerning, I find myself almost never listening to him anymore. He is a favorite of guitar players, but I think its telling to see how many other jazz musicians listen to him. Relatively few. Joe built a legacy on chops, not musicality. He isnt quite as musically deficient as someone like Yngwie, but its close in my mind.
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Fredrik



Joined: 18 Jul 2005
Posts: 62
Location: Norway

PostPosted: Thu Jan 19, 2006 9:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Staffan William-Olsson ( awesome Swedish player who lives here in Norway


Staffan's great, I was at a concert with him last year when he was filling in for Mezzoforte. Very Happy

By the way have you heard Nils Olav Johansen. He has also played with the late Sigurd KÝhn, but is perhaps most famous for his work Farmers Market.
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PaulD



Joined: 18 Sep 2004
Posts: 1129
Location: Chicago

PostPosted: Thu Jan 19, 2006 11:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The first time I saw Joe Pass was at the Jazz Showcase in Chicago in 1973, when it was on Rush Street. I had only read about him and had never heard him play. I was about 2 feet away from him. He played a solo gig. I had never seen anyone play like him before. That night totally turned me around as far as my guitar playing. So I have a soft spot for Joe.

"Tudo Bem", "Chops","Catch Me" and "For Django" are all favorite JP albums of mine. I like to let beginning jazz guitarists listen to "6 string Santa" just because the Christmas tunes are chock full of common changes and Joe plays a ton of "stock Joe Pass lines" over them.

Paul
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alfonso



Joined: 25 May 2005
Posts: 1258
Location: Sacramento

PostPosted: Fri Jan 20, 2006 2:48 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

My influences when I first started playing Jazz were Herb Ellis, Charlie Byrd, & Chet Atkins. I actually started playing guitar cause my Brother played, so he was very influential for me and also a singer songwriter by the name of Roger Vourdouris, he had a top 40 hit and I went to school with him. It was really cool cause he showed me a lot, but has since passed on. peace Cool
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JakeJew



Joined: 30 Jul 2005
Posts: 2190
Location: Boston, MA

PostPosted: Fri Jan 20, 2006 3:33 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Coltrane wrote:
JakeJew wrote:
A critique of Joe Pass

Although I admire his vocabulary, I could never get to into Joe Pass. His feel always seems very rigid and mechanical to me...not a lot of subtlety in his playing, it's sometimes almost computer like. His swing 8th notes have a very blunt triplet feel to them, more so than most others I listen to.

Has anybody else observed this? I know he's regarded as one of the greats, and I can get into the greats...Wes, Tal, Jimmy Raney, Jim Hall, Charlie Christian...but Joe Pass man, I can't get too into him.


I agree completely. Like most, I was completely wowed by Joe's playing at first, and really amazed at what he could pull off. As my ears became more discerning, I find myself almost never listening to him anymore. He is a favorite of guitar players, but I think its telling to see how many other jazz musicians listen to him. Relatively few. Joe built a legacy on chops, not musicality. He isnt quite as musically deficient as someone like Yngwie, but its close in my mind.


Interesting observations...As an interesting contrast, I feel like so many non guitarists think so highly of Wes.
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Quinn Brown



Joined: 14 Aug 2005
Posts: 106

PostPosted: Fri Jan 20, 2006 4:52 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Influences are Kenny B, Django, Wynton Kelly and 'Trane.
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dchos



Joined: 03 Jan 2006
Posts: 27

PostPosted: Fri Jan 20, 2006 5:42 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I really envy you American guys. Hey Woodsy, seeing Kenny in Detroit must have been a life changing experience for you. He is my favourite player. His tone is like liquid, smooth legato yet with a dirty edge. He ALWAYS swings, his phrasing is so organic and the language of the blues can be heard in most everything he plays.

Jazz is a uniquely American art form and to be able to see the master players in small local venues must be mind blowing to say the least. On that note there is a guy in Sydney, Australia that has been blowing minds for the last few years by the name of James Muller. Scofield has given him big wraps (Guitar One magazine Dec. 2005, p. 101.) and it's good to hear praise like this for one of our own local guys. Has anyone else heard or heard of James ?
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steve



Joined: 04 Jun 2005
Posts: 867
Location: oz

PostPosted: Fri Jan 20, 2006 8:21 am    Post subject: james muller Reply with quote

Hey dchos, I think I caught him on the radio a few years ago winning some competition in Sydney or Melbourne. If it's the same guy (who played with quite an "electric" sound, bit like Scofield) then I remember being blown away and actually liking his playing more than Scofield's 'cause I liked how his solos had a bit more mmmmmm square corners to them, as opposed to Scofield who I find a bit too ambigious for listeneing to for long periods.
How to you like Doug DeVries playing?
My favourite aussie jazzer would have to be Joe Chindamo (piano). Have you heard him? awesome player.
cheers
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woodsy



Joined: 22 Dec 2005
Posts: 20

PostPosted: Fri Jan 20, 2006 2:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

dchos

Yes, seeing him play was truly amazing. It was in a small club in Detroit called Baker's Keyboard Lounge. My uncle and I were literally a few feet from him, as it is a small venue.

I agree with you about his tone. Actually, I remeber someone telling me that Jimi Hendrix envied Burrell's tone and was considering moving in that direction before he died.

Anyone ever checked out Barry Galbraith's playing? He is another player that has that sumptuous tone.
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Last edited by woodsy on Thu Feb 03, 2011 7:53 pm; edited 3 times in total
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PaulD



Joined: 18 Sep 2004
Posts: 1129
Location: Chicago

PostPosted: Fri Jan 20, 2006 8:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I grew up listening to my Dadís record collection, which included Benny Goodman, Luis Armstrong, Artie Shaw, Duke Ellington, etc. One of my earliest guitar influences was actually Carlos Santana. I know, heís not a jazz player, but I always liked his playing (at least his early playing) and you can still hear bits of it in my playing. Through Carlos I got into McLaughlin, Corea & Coryell, who led me to Martino & Diorio, who led me Wes, Miles & Trane, who led me to back to Bird, Miles, Rollins, & Stitt. I was able to steal little bits from each so that now I have about 20 licks that I can play in endless combinations Very Happy Very Happy

Paul
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dchos



Joined: 03 Jan 2006
Posts: 27

PostPosted: Fri Jan 20, 2006 10:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hey Steve, Yeah I've heard Joe play but I don't think he's in Sydney anymore, it's too hard to make a living here playing. All of our top players end up moving to the U.K (Carl Orr, Ian Date, David Blenkhorn etc.) or going back to New Zealand. Haven't heard DeVries, there are so many monster players out there and so little time.........By the way, Kenny Burrell was the reason that I turned from rock guitar to jazz. After I first heard Midnight Blue I thought "I can do that," and I'm still trying. He remains my inspiration, nobody interprets an Ellington tune with a depth of feeling like Kenny.
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