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real books
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john



Joined: 20 Jun 2007
Posts: 21
Location: Los Angeles

PostPosted: Fri Jun 29, 2007 6:48 pm    Post subject: real books Reply with quote

I was looking at Real books on Amazon and discovered that there are several. Which one shoud I get? theres a vol 1, 2 , 3 , compact etc.

There is also a guy on Ebay that does digital delivery but I fingured that by the time I bought the paper and ink and got it punched and got a binder it wouldnt save any money. Also I am not sure what the product is. I have heard that there is a compilation that guys used to pass around that had a lot of mistakes in it.
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Elegant Warmth



Joined: 15 Oct 2006
Posts: 73
Location: p-town OR

PostPosted: Fri Jun 29, 2007 7:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

well i used to live next to this amazing jazz drummer who was a long time friend of my dads and when i started getting into music he gave me this disc with about 12 different realbooks on it, and out of all those i would recommend the straight up RealBook vol. 1 or the NewRealbook vol.1
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cjm



Joined: 16 Oct 2006
Posts: 369

PostPosted: Fri Jun 29, 2007 8:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I've used the old "illegal" real book in years past.

I think the three volume "Real Book" set published by Hal Leonard comes pretty close to being the same resource to musicians in the first volume alone and volumes two and three represent a considerable expansion of the original resource.

I also think it is becoming the new "standard," and if you show up to jam sessions where "real book" changes are mandatory, the three Hal Leonard books are probably the best thing to have in your gig bag that can be easily obtained today.
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john



Joined: 20 Jun 2007
Posts: 21
Location: Los Angeles

PostPosted: Sat Jun 30, 2007 5:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

"illegal" you say? do you think that the guy selling downloaed on ebay is illegal
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Elegant Warmth



Joined: 15 Oct 2006
Posts: 73
Location: p-town OR

PostPosted: Sat Jun 30, 2007 5:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

could be illegal but its not really a big deal............all the realbooks were illegal a couple years ago
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cjm



Joined: 16 Oct 2006
Posts: 369

PostPosted: Sun Jul 01, 2007 2:25 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

john wrote:
"illegal" you say? do you think that the guy selling downloaed on ebay is illegal


The "illegal" book I referred to was the original "Real Book" -- a collection of lead sheets that were in circulation for many years and "illegal" because there was never an attempt to secure rights to publish them. In one sense, it may not have been paricularly illegal because as far as I know there was never any attempt to enforce the copyrights.

In any event, this was the inspiration for the Hal Leonard books. I don't know about the guy on Ebay offering downloads, but there is a collection of 10 fake books circulating on the 'net for free download and it is illegaly circulated...

...but there are some good charts in it. Wink
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alfonso



Joined: 25 May 2005
Posts: 1258
Location: Sacramento

PostPosted: Sun Jul 01, 2007 4:21 pm    Post subject: Re: real books Reply with quote

john,
PM me if you're interested in getting the books on CD. later

john wrote:
I was looking at Real books on Amazon and discovered that there are several. Which one shoud I get? theres a vol 1, 2 , 3 , compact etc.

There is also a guy on Ebay that does digital delivery but I fingured that by the time I bought the paper and ink and got it punched and got a binder it wouldnt save any money. Also I am not sure what the product is. I have heard that there is a compilation that guys used to pass around that had a lot of mistakes in it.
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alfonso



Joined: 25 May 2005
Posts: 1258
Location: Sacramento

PostPosted: Sun Jul 01, 2007 4:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

cjm,
Yeah I got those 10 fake books however the link has been closed for quite awhile. It was a great deal well over $100.00 worth of fakebooks for free, someone did musicians a great deed by offering these for free. Some will argue copyright laws etc., to them I say. Musicians as a whole don't have alot of money otherwise we'd all be playing Gibsons, Gretch or the guitar of our choice, so go get into a different business. just my 2 cents. later

cjm wrote:
but there is a collection of 10 fake books circulating on the 'net for free download and it is illegaly circulated...

...but there are some good charts in it. Wink
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john



Joined: 20 Jun 2007
Posts: 21
Location: Los Angeles

PostPosted: Sun Jul 01, 2007 8:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I dont really know what the truth is about all that copyright stuff but my take on it at this point is that if someone writes a chart off some recording or from a song someone taught them I am not stealing anything or breaking any law either. This is especially true of standards. They are like the Star spangled banner or Tom Dooley. These belong to the people.Ablsolutely and certainly no problem if there is no payment involved. If I were to photocopy a commercially printed book verbatim and sold it to the world that seems to me to be a completely different thing.
So any charts you would like to make available to fellow musicians is just helping the musical community and I think the music business. Toward that end I would like to offer this site, http://www.realbooklisten.com/
There are so many songs out there that I have not heard and do not want to spend money for sight unheard. But this is a sight that lets you hear the original tunes. If you like it then you can buy it. Like Alfonso said I dont have the money to just buy all the recordings out there. For example I like the song "A fine romance" but after listening to the original I dont want to spend what little cash I have on the CD. As always IMO
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john



Joined: 20 Jun 2007
Posts: 21
Location: Los Angeles

PostPosted: Mon Jul 02, 2007 12:10 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Igiro,
I appreciate your thoughts on this and I recognized the fact that there are different opinions. What I like about this forum is it is like getting together at a eatery or bar after a gig or concert and just talking with people of like interest, pretty neat.
I of course dont agree with you and my statement was not that my economic situation authorizes economic advantages others dont have. Perhaps I didnt explain it well enough but knowing what something sounds like will help me buy it. Not knowing I wont. When I was a kid music stores would have listening booths. If you liked it you could buy it or not. I just think sharing helps the music business as well as musicians. I do not think that we will be able to resolve the issue on this thread but I certainly want you to be able to express your thoughts. Same for me.
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cjm



Joined: 16 Oct 2006
Posts: 369

PostPosted: Mon Jul 02, 2007 1:42 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well, one thing is for certain: simply buying the three Hal Leonard Real Book volumes will eliminate any illegality and allow you to avoid the inconvenience and expense of printing and hole punching about 1300~1400 songs in lead sheet form -- most with decent changes and already in the most commonly used keys.

The most recent editions have been cleaned up the most in terms of errors...look for The Real Book, 6th edition and The Real Book Volumes 2 and 3, 2nd edition, if you want the better edited (and more legible) versions.

By the way, these three volumes from Hal Leonard, are included on the illegal download of ten fakebooks, but they're all earlier editions and they're not as well edited.

I freely admit to having downloaded the illegal file and I used to use a lot of lead sheets from the original illegal Real Book.

BUT...legal and ethical considerations aside, one of the problems we all confront is the problem in getting our hands on an archive of material to use on gigs...so why not act in our own enlightened self interest and reward a publisher who saw our need and stepped up with a decent product -- by buying that product?

I see the premium prices a lot of players shell out for guitars, amps, strings, etc., that are fancier and more elaborate than strictly required (or for guitars that have collector's demand driving the price far above intrinsic value), and then hear them complain about having to drop $100 for a lead sheet library that will handle a huge number of gigs...doesn't really stand up to close examination.
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woodshedder



Joined: 31 Mar 2006
Posts: 44

PostPosted: Mon Jul 02, 2007 1:47 am    Post subject: Real Books Reply with quote

I completely agree with IGIRO. It's easy to rationalize anything when you want something. This material is copyrighted and you are screwing the original artist out of potential money. This is not an opinion, it is the law and a fact.
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john



Joined: 20 Jun 2007
Posts: 21
Location: Los Angeles

PostPosted: Mon Jul 02, 2007 3:44 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

ok each side has had a chance to express their opinions. Hopefully it has been done without acrimony. What CJM has said makes sense.
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jazzerchick



Joined: 31 Oct 2006
Posts: 968
Location: SanAntonio , Tx

PostPosted: Mon Jul 02, 2007 6:05 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

There are lots of old fake books that were around long before the illegal
Real books. Dance band books full of lead sheets, three tunes to a page,
and some Dixieland fake books. I have some really old ones passed on to
me by an elderly player, a dance band leader from NY,who was giving
away all his stuff.
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alfonso



Joined: 25 May 2005
Posts: 1258
Location: Sacramento

PostPosted: Mon Jul 02, 2007 6:35 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Wow! Some players are just sticklers when it comes to copyright laws. I've downloaded the 10 free RealBooks and I was also given quite a few videos downloads that I later found out were copyrighted. In the words of Miles Davis, So What? It doesn't make a difference to me, I'm just one of thousands of struggling guitar players the Giants in Jazz know all about us little guys. Whether your for or against free music it doesn't matter to me, I didn't steal anything and I think it's really petty to bring theft into the mix. If it's on the internet then it's free. I've never seen something say here's "10 free RealBooks", steal them if you want. Some players on this forum come off as being holier than thou, give it a rest already your point was heard and accepted. Meaning if another person or friend offers me music for free again or I run across it again on the internet, I'm sure I'll take a freebie. Musicians put that stuff up to give to other musicians a chance to get something that they received for free, to give away for free. Those 10 free RealBooks were around for years before someone had the brainchild to share with a larger audience. later
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