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Aria Pro II Herb Ellis PE 175
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greentone



Joined: 31 May 2008
Posts: 670

PostPosted: Thu Dec 04, 2008 2:37 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi,

I found out from the seller of the Aria Pro II PE-180 that the guitar sold privately today.
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dewey decibel



Joined: 15 Feb 2006
Posts: 1677

PostPosted: Thu Dec 04, 2008 5:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Oh well...


I probably wouldn't have bid anyway, I just don't have the cash at the moment. But I think we'll be seeing more and more of these come up for good prices (I've already seen a couple), so I'll just bide my time.
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greentone



Joined: 31 May 2008
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PostPosted: Thu Dec 04, 2008 8:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

It's a good time for folks with some cash to buy guitars. The prices are getting right. At the shows the prices are falling, just like stocks, etc. If you have had your eye on a collectible or on a player...

Trouble is, everybody's cash stash has been falling, too.
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jbmoore



Joined: 21 Sep 2008
Posts: 2
Location: Boston

PostPosted: Thu Dec 04, 2008 2:41 pm    Post subject: Aria PE-175 Reply with quote

My guess is that the very expensive collectables (i.e. >$20K) will start to come down a bit because of the shrinking pool of buyers, but the 'player' mildly-collectable guitars like the Arias will only come down a bit since they're already such a great bargain when compared to a new guitar of similar quality. Of course this could just be wishful thinking since I own a PE-175 Herb Ellis (although I wasn't planning on selling it anytime soon...)
Jeff
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greentone



Joined: 31 May 2008
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PostPosted: Thu Dec 04, 2008 5:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I suspect you are right. By the way, you own a heck of a good player/collectible. I always thought the PE-175 was THE bargain out there. It is really well made, it has great sounding pickups, and folks bid the prices of other Japanese guitars up higher (e.g., the Ibanez archtops).

I think the PE-175s with the soundposts are innovative and really nice sounding. Ellis would have stayed with his, but Matsumoku stopped building archtops in the early 80s which left him high and dry as far as his endorsement deal went. He switched back to playing out with his old ES-175 and Gibson came up with the Herb Ellis model.
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jbmoore



Joined: 21 Sep 2008
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Location: Boston

PostPosted: Thu Dec 04, 2008 6:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks for your note. Do you happen to know where I can get a pickguard for it? The liklihood of finding an original (with the HE on it) is about 0%, so I'd settle for one made for a Gibson. I'll be in Japan in a week, and will ask around at the guitar shops as well.
Jeff
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sunflower



Joined: 09 Mar 2007
Posts: 581

PostPosted: Thu Dec 04, 2008 9:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

dewey decibel wrote:
Oh well...


I probably wouldn't have bid anyway, I just don't have the cash at the moment. But I think we'll be seeing more and more of these come up for good prices (I've already seen a couple), so I'll just bide my time.


me too dewey ....
don't worry tho I won't be getting into any bidding wars
(see 'if you could have any guitar' thead !)

What'd it go for anyway GT ?

Jem
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greentone



Joined: 31 May 2008
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 05, 2008 3:06 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

[quote="sunflower"]
dewey decibel wrote:
What'd it go for anyway GT ?

Jem


Don't know.
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dewey decibel



Joined: 15 Feb 2006
Posts: 1677

PostPosted: Tue Dec 09, 2008 12:54 am    Post subject: Re: Aria PE-175 Reply with quote

Hey Greentone- there's a Conti up there now (with a floater though, no CC). And if you look at the name of the seller, I think you pretty much need to buy it...

http://cgi.ebay.com/1980-Aria-Robert-Conti-L5-C-Jazz-Guitar_W0QQitemZ330292097078QQcmdZViewItemQQptZGuitar?hash=item330292097078&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14&_trkparms=72%3A1205%7C66%3A2%7C65%3A12%7C39%3A1%7C240%3A1318%7C301%3A1%7C293%3A1%7C294%3A50
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sunflower



Joined: 09 Mar 2007
Posts: 581

PostPosted: Tue Dec 09, 2008 1:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thats nice , but v expensive

He says
Quote:
Hand carved solid spruce top with a hand carved solid flamed and quilted maple back and sides.


Can that be correct GT ..... laminated surely ?
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dewey decibel



Joined: 15 Feb 2006
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PostPosted: Tue Dec 09, 2008 5:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm pretty sure the Robert Conti models were carved. Same with the Ibanez 2470 and 2471. Often when those guys made an L-5 copy with a floater it was carved (but not always)...
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greentone



Joined: 31 May 2008
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PostPosted: Wed Dec 10, 2008 3:25 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ha! That's great. A neat guitar from a seller with an obvious good taste in jazz--he adopted the moniker "greentone" for his ebay name. Great coincidence. I appreciate the Matsumoku instruments and I really appreciate both Grant and Freddie Green--arbiters of tone in their respective genres of jazz guitar.

The PE-190 Robert Conti model for sale looks like a good one. The pickup and pickguard are swapped out. There were two models of the PE-190: the Robert Conti model and the Charlie Christian model. Both were L5 copies, but they differed in terms of the pickup. Both guitars were made for Conti, as I understand it, but one had the set in the top CC bar pickup.

Solid top or laminate top? I've never evaluated one in person, so I can't say for sure. Could be solid, but I'd guess laminate, just judging from some Ibanez acoustic L5 copies I've seen from that period.

Price? You'll pay over $5,000 for a same-period Gibson. (worth it) Remember, Matsumoku made the Epiphone (Japan) guitars from the era in question. The 1970-era Matsumoku guitars are the bonafide lawsuit guitars--Aria, Greco, Ibanez, Penco, etc. These guitars go for between $1,000 and $2,000.
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greentone



Joined: 31 May 2008
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PostPosted: Wed Dec 10, 2008 3:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The Robert Conti model might have been carved. Here is a URL with close up photos of it. Notice that, like the other high-end lawsuit copies by Matsumoku, it features the Super-400 size headstock. Beautiful guitar.

http://www.matsumoku.org/models/ariaproii/pe/nptype/pe190/rc/pics.html
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greentone



Joined: 31 May 2008
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PostPosted: Wed Dec 10, 2008 3:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Here's the PE-190 Charlie Christian Model. I'd like to run across one of these at a guitar show. Very interesting.

http://www.matsumoku.org/models/ariaproii/pe/nptype/pe190/cc/pics.html

PS: look _carefully_ when considering purchasing used ES175s. I've picked up guitars at shows that were being shown as Gibsons that upon close inspections were very nice Matsumokus that were re-worked with Gibson inlays on the headstock. I have a good friend who does inlay work for guitar companies. This is _easy_ work for a pro. The Matsumokus that sold under all those brand names in the 70s are great guitars, but I don't imagine they'd command Gibson prices. Putting a Gibson inlay on there is fraudulent--unless the seller expressly tells you that "this is a re-branded copy."
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greentone



Joined: 31 May 2008
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PostPosted: Thu Dec 11, 2008 4:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Joe's Vintage Guitars has a gorgeous Aria L1000c for sale on eBay. Kind of pricey, but check it out to look at the great photos. Search eBay for:

1974 L5ces by Aria Crafted in Japan High End Jazz Box

My guitar looks exactly like this one. Notice the binding at the end of the frets--just like Gibson.

One thing I can attest about these guitars by Matsumoku is that the pickups sound _on the money_ like the old Gibsons.

There is something about this particular model. To me, it represents a high water mark in Japanese electric hollow body construction. If you get a chance to play one at a shop or a show, I think you'll be very impressed. They play and sound even better than the maple-topped PE-175 Herb Ellis model (which is also an excellent guitar).
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