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What the hell - the epi es 175
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mapio08



Joined: 01 Nov 2008
Posts: 57

PostPosted: Mon Nov 30, 2009 2:25 pm    Post subject: What the hell - the epi es 175 Reply with quote

Hi everyone,

I was just playing thru a couple of guitars. I want to get a second one, my current one is the emperor regent by epiphone. I love it. Now in addition I want one with a mounted humbucker not a floater. So I went to the store and played an ibanez af105, an ibanez pm 35, an epiphone es 175 and a framus az10.

ok, every one was fitted with roundwounds which is not my thing. but the only guitar totally killing me right away was the epi es 175. feeling, sound, workmanship...I played thru a roland cube 80, an aer compact 60 and a princeton reverb.

the framus was great too, but the setup was very very odd.

now I am wondering: am I about to make a huge mistake or is anybody with me when I say I think of buying the 175. I thought its a cheap piece of something...!!! No it is NOT!!

I did not expect this and Ive been playing for 23 years now...

thanx matt
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randyc



Joined: 14 Sep 2006
Posts: 407
Location: Eureka, CA

PostPosted: Mon Nov 30, 2009 8:02 pm    Post subject: Re: What the hell - the epi es 175 Reply with quote

[quote="mapio08now I am wondering: am I about to make a huge mistake or is anybody with me when I say I think of buying the 175. I thought its a cheap piece of something...!!! No it is NOT!![/quote]

Save your money for a bit, buy something that you'll be proud to pass along to your children.
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Secret2goodtoneispractice



Joined: 21 Jan 2006
Posts: 271
Location: Spinning & shimmering aqueous sphere

PostPosted: Mon Nov 30, 2009 8:41 pm    Post subject: Re: What the hell - the epi es 175 Reply with quote

mapio08 wrote:
. . . anybody with me when I say I think of buying the 175? . . . I did not expect this and Ive been playing for 23 years . . .

Well, it is quite alright to trust yourself, especially when you have done some comparison shopping. The ES-175 is a benchmark jazz guitar icon . . . if you are able to find a nice Asian model at a comfortable price, and you are HAPPY, what is not to like? Do not confuse cost with value, especially when considering a laminated wood electric guitar. Enjoy!
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Trust your own opinion of a guitar or amp. Form your opinion from what you value. Your need, preference, circumstance, experience, and opportunity are the most important factors.
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randyc



Joined: 14 Sep 2006
Posts: 407
Location: Eureka, CA

PostPosted: Mon Nov 30, 2009 9:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Secret2goodtoneispractice wrote:
Do not confuse cost with value, especially when considering a laminated wood electric guitar. Enjoy!


Exactly, although we may not have the same reasons for saying this. Check out the recent thread on American guitar values, to get an idea of how good quality jazz guitars appreciate.

http://www.playjazzguitar.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=4875
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Secret2goodtoneispractice



Joined: 21 Jan 2006
Posts: 271
Location: Spinning & shimmering aqueous sphere

PostPosted: Tue Dec 01, 2009 12:02 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

A guitar, to many, is an utility item. It is a tool with a purpose: to make music.

In this scenario, using a guitar is like riding a bus. If you need to ride the bus today at 5, you take the bus that shows up. It takes you to your desired destination.

Suppose that in five years, the bus authority will replace current buses with luxury Mercedes buses. It is possible that a rider chooses not to ride the bus until the desired new models are provided.

If a rider wants to ride today at 5, he will likely be happy with the bus that shows up. The upgrade bus that arrives in the future is of no help for riding today. And, there is no guarantee that the new buses will ever be purchased.

If you find a guitar that you are happy with today, it's absolutely fine to buy it and make good music. A bird in the hand . . .

However, there is also wisdom in saving for a special guitar. You can do that anytime.
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Trust your own opinion of a guitar or amp. Form your opinion from what you value. Your need, preference, circumstance, experience, and opportunity are the most important factors.
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randyc



Joined: 14 Sep 2006
Posts: 407
Location: Eureka, CA

PostPosted: Tue Dec 01, 2009 12:19 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Secret2goodtoneispractice wrote:
...In this scenario, using a guitar is like riding a bus. If you need to ride the bus today at 5, you take the bus that shows up. It takes you to your desired destination.

Suppose that in five years, the bus authority will replace current buses with luxury Mercedes buses. It is possible that a rider chooses not to ride the bus until the desired new models are provided.

If a rider wants to ride today at 5, he will likely be happy with the bus that shows up. The upgrade bus that arrives in the future is of no help for riding today. And, there is no guarantee that the new buses will ever be purchased...


Perhaps you missed the part where the OP said that he already owned a guitar ? Taking this into consideration you'd have to add a sentence to your analogy, maybe something like this: "the rider continues to make his normal, scheduled journeys on the Number Nine bus while waiting for the luxury buses to become available". Of course, if you made that modification, the point would be .... well, sort of pointless Smile

No soup for you today.
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sunflower



Joined: 09 Mar 2007
Posts: 581

PostPosted: Tue Dec 01, 2009 1:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
now I am wondering: am I about to make a huge mistake or is anybody with me when I say I think of buying the 175.


Hi Matt,

If it plays good and sounds good , it is good
all guitars are individuals , and another
epi 175 will play and sound differently anyway

Jem
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Secret2goodtoneispractice



Joined: 21 Jan 2006
Posts: 271
Location: Spinning & shimmering aqueous sphere

PostPosted: Tue Dec 01, 2009 2:06 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

randyc wrote:
. . . No soup for you today.

Thank you for confirming the soup dispensation suspicion.
_________________
Beware of alliances that are formed by dividing relationships of others.
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Trust your own opinion of a guitar or amp. Form your opinion from what you value. Your need, preference, circumstance, experience, and opportunity are the most important factors.
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randyc



Joined: 14 Sep 2006
Posts: 407
Location: Eureka, CA

PostPosted: Tue Dec 01, 2009 2:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Secret2goodtoneispractice wrote:
randyc wrote:
. . . No soup for you today.

Thank you for confirming the soup dispensation suspicion.


LOL, I note the consistency of your responses: you dispute only those of my statements involving "opinion" rather than knowledge, that's a pretty safe position. Nevertheless, it's flattering to have my words monitored so closely, thank you Smile
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Jazz Playa



Joined: 11 Mar 2009
Posts: 346

PostPosted: Wed Dec 02, 2009 5:40 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Secret2goodtoneispractice wrote:
A guitar, to many, is an utility item. It is a tool with a purpose: to make music.

In this scenario, using a guitar is like riding a bus. If you need to ride the bus today at 5, you take the bus that shows up. It takes you to your desired destination.

Suppose that in five years, the bus authority will replace current buses with luxury Mercedes buses. It is possible that a rider chooses not to ride the bus until the desired new models are provided.

If a rider wants to ride today at 5, he will likely be happy with the bus that shows up. The upgrade bus that arrives in the future is of no help for riding today. And, there is no guarantee that the new buses will ever be purchased.

If you find a guitar that you are happy with today, it's absolutely fine to buy it and make good music. A bird in the hand . . .

However, there is also wisdom in saving for a special guitar. You can do that anytime.


Since were kinda on the subject of ES175's I came across an interesting piece of trivia about Pat Metheny and his 175 while searching for something else last night. Its from an interview he did in 1995:

Bonzai: What are your main guitar models?

Metheny: The main guitar I play is an old Gibson ES-175 that I got for a hundred bucks from this guy in Missouri when I was 13 years old. It was essentially my first guitar, and it still works great. That's the one I really like, and then I've got a million other guitars for particular needs. There's a fantastic guitar-maker in Canada named Linda Manzer, who made me a variety of special acoustic guitars. I've also worked with Ibanez for the last ten years to develop a PM model that's loosely based on the 175 but is an updated jazz guitar style that they will actually release.

I never new he got that ES175 for a hundred bucks Shocked WOW. I bet that was the best 100 bucks he ever spent. Seems so many of us guitar players almost obsess over which guitar we pick to be our main guitar. I can really understand that because there's a huge amount of "bonding" that takes place between a guitarist and his instrument for some reason (well for a lot of us that is). Look at Metheny for example, he got that guitar when he was 13 years old, stuck with it through his teenage years and Berkley, then stayed with "her" Laughing through 30 more years of intense touring and recording. Even though recently he finally had to switch guitars because the 175 just couldn't take anymore road abuse I sincerely doubt he will ever part with the 175. Sounds like love to me Laughing

So I agree with both your statements, that a guitar is an instrument to make music but also those special instruments sometimes come along that you really bond with. I think that both of those statements can be true at the same time. The journey to finding that special one can be a lot of fun too. Wink
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randyc



Joined: 14 Sep 2006
Posts: 407
Location: Eureka, CA

PostPosted: Wed Dec 02, 2009 6:07 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

JP,

That's an interesting anecdote and supports the opinions of most: the ES-175 is "the" jazz guitar. The seminal influences (the period 1950 - 1970) always seem to include artists that used this instrument.

I don't have one and I wish that I did. I have the carved-top version, L-4CES, and I love it, but I'd still like to own a P-90, single pickup fifties model that produced those classic sounds ...

BUT I don't think that the Asian version, the Epiphone copy, is in the same world. (I note that you didn't say that, so take no offense.)

cheers,
randyc
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tonyteech



Joined: 20 Nov 2006
Posts: 86
Location: E London

PostPosted: Wed Dec 02, 2009 2:44 pm    Post subject: Epi 175 Reply with quote

I have one of these guitar Cost 350 in the UK great value for money
powerful pickups and well made. Not the real thing but IMO at least as good as the other competitors at the price range Gets good reviews as well. They orignally retailed for 550 ish in the UK but are now discontinued. Peerless get mixed reviews in the UK. A Scottish firm called Freshman got good reviews for its archtop models
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Jazzie



Joined: 27 Sep 2009
Posts: 19
Location: US

PostPosted: Thu Dec 03, 2009 6:05 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

So what are we talking about a $500 Epiphone verses a $4,000 Gibson. Man, if the Epi feels good and it sounds good and it makes you want to play guitar then you would be nuts not to buy it. Hell, buy eight of them and smash them on stage at your favorite jazz club. Dance with them and set them on fire like Jimi Hendrix. At least you won't be afraid to take it to a gig for fear of scratches. The $4,000 Gibson investment is destined to be a shelf queen.
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randyc



Joined: 14 Sep 2006
Posts: 407
Location: Eureka, CA

PostPosted: Thu Dec 03, 2009 4:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Jazzie wrote:
So what are we talking about a $500 Epiphone verses a $4,000 Gibson. Man, if the Epi feels good and it sounds good and it makes you want to play guitar then you would be nuts not to buy it. Hell, buy eight of them and smash them on stage at your favorite jazz club. Dance with them and set them on fire like Jimi Hendrix. At least you won't be afraid to take it to a gig for fear of scratches. The $4,000 Gibson investment is destined to be a shelf queen.


Buy it and hang it on the wall and let it appreciate ? I know that there are people who do such things but I didn't think that they could be found HERE ! Buy it, PLAY it and let it appreciate. No matter what you do to a quality American-made jazz guitar, short of abusing it, the instrument WILL appreciate.

The thing doesn't have to kept in the dark and polished once a month ... these instruments were made to be PLAYED, and that's how the best guitarists of the past century have treated them ! If you're on a budget, just look around: beautiful old Guilds are available for the cost of a midrange Asian instrument !

Adding yet another permutation, one could buy the Epiphone, hang it on the wall and let it DEPRECIATE, of course, because that's what it's going to do, whether you treat it as a rare delicacy or beat the s--t out of it Smile

Maybe I'm in the wrong forum ? Seems like, when I first joined this group, it was mostly professionals using professional equipment. More and more, this and the other forums seem to be evolving into advertising for the Chinese version of NAAMI ...

Oh well, we're just a small slice of the American Pie that is soon to be a wholly-owned Chinese Subsidiary Smile
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M



Joined: 02 Jan 2009
Posts: 331
Location: Northern VA (USA)

PostPosted: Thu Dec 03, 2009 4:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

randyc wrote:
Oh well, we're just a small slice of the American Pie that is soon to be a wholly-owned Chinese Subsidiary Smile


Often referred to as "Chimerica." Wink
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